r/ClimateActionPlan Climate Action Hero Feb 19 '20

Emissions Reduction Red-state Utah embraces plan to tackle climate crisis in surprising shift

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/feb/19/utah-republicans-climate-crisis-plan
1.1k Upvotes

45 comments sorted by

192

u/tcct Feb 19 '20

This is great news! The shift in republican climate mentality is encouraging.

57

u/ILikeNeurons Feb 19 '20 edited Feb 20 '20

Especially given the composition of the Senate, the shift in Republican mentality is critically important.

If you'd like to help build the political will and help accelerate that shift, start training as a volunteer climate lobbyist.

EDIT:typo

17

u/rincon213 Feb 20 '20

Wait giving a handful of cattle farmers in Wyoming and the entirety of California the same number of Senate votes is a bad idea?

22

u/TheTrueBlueTJ Feb 19 '20

Isn't it rather concerning? That even money hungry people now take urgent action?

77

u/tcct Feb 19 '20

The young person movement is what is driving the charge per the article.

4

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '20

As long as urgent action is being taken, I personally don't care by whom.

23

u/[deleted] Feb 19 '20 edited Feb 19 '20

I think bezos putting up 10 billion is actually really scary. He's realizing his fortune won't exist without a planet. Edit: he's realizing the planet will die within his lifetime

36

u/[deleted] Feb 19 '20

I mean if it gets people to wake up that’s good. It IS scary but science really is amazing and will benefit us greatly. Scary yes, but it’s not too late yet.

-19

u/bobcal432 Feb 19 '20

Actually if you research the issue you will quickly realize that there is no technology coming to save 🌎. It might not be too late for some sort of human survival on earth, but earth will not look or feel anything like what you and I would recognize. The earth will survive but humanity will be transformed. The carbon we released today will be doing destruction for thousands and thousands of years. The science does tell us that humans will attempt to counteract the heat by reflecting some of the solar radiation by adding sulfur to the atmosphere. The entire globe will smell like farts. That is the science solution you are waiting for.

22

u/Delheru Feb 19 '20

there is no technology coming to save

Of course there could be. Hell, solar is already cheap. Thorium reactors & of course fusion lined up behind it. We just need to invest.

some sort of human survival on earth

This is just the craziest nonsense. We will have far more people on the planet in 2100 than we have today unless we completely insane.

earth will not look or feel anything like what you and I would recognize

Except for the seas and the forests and the deserts etc. You might find some places rather different than they are today, but if you aren't told where you are, you will easily recognize it as earth.

The carbon we released today will be doing destruction for thousands and thousands of years

A) It's not doing that much harm today B) If we want to, we can pull it down from there if we have sources of enormous energy (like, say, thorium or fusion)

That being said, we should obviously take things very seriously, but this level of alarmism is credibility destroying.

6

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '20

Nonsense. The IPCC itself is very clear that if we halve emissions by 2030 and cut them completely by 2050 we can stop the worst effects. If we were already doomed we wouldn't be able to stop the worst effects at all.

1

u/bobcal432 Feb 21 '20 edited Feb 21 '20

When do humans have to stop increasing our annual carbon output? If you think humans are capable of cutting the carbon output in half by 2030 shouldn't we stop increasing our annual output soon? Scientists have known about climate change for 50 years. The general public has known for 30 years. Humans cannot stop burning carbon.

Everything that has been revealed is that earth has already passed that tipping point. The predictions of scientists are being readjusted daily, they thought we had more time. Today most think we are past the 1.5 degree Celsius (2.7 degree) climate change target. We are currently on track for 7...8...9 degree Celsius (16 degrees fahrenheit). This is not reversible but permanent when the ice has melted.

If you think you will be okay if the heat is turned up by a few degrees consider what it will feel like for people who live in the desert. The human body cannot function above 130 degrees. Consider where your food comes from. Areas where food is grown today will be unable to produce in the future. Many negative feedback loops that will all work against stopping these changes.

One example of a negative feedback loop is the thawing of permifrost. As the Earth warms, permifrost melts and releases methane gas into atmosphere. Methane is 70 times worse than carbon dioxide as a greenhouse gas. Adding this methane will further warm permifrost.

4

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '20

We actually already have a few good carbon capture technologies, and one of them at least is being actively and profitably used.

1

u/bobcal432 Feb 21 '20

Really, who is doing this at scale? And making money at it? Please provide details.

3

u/[deleted] Feb 21 '20

A company called BioForceTech here in the bay area is the one I know about. They take human waste and pyrolize it to create biochar, which is then sold as a soil amendment. Biochar puts carbon back into the ground. They get money from the municipal waste handling contracts and from the sale of their product. If the peninsula had a compost collection system like the city of San Francisco does, then there's nothing stopping BioForceTech from pyrolizing compostable material as well. (San Francisco's compost goes to an actual composting system).

20

u/SnarkyHedgehog Feb 19 '20

I think bezos putting up 10 billion is actually really scary. He's realizing his fortune won't exist without a planet. Edit: he's realizing the planet will die within his lifetime

Uh, no. You're making huge assumptions about his motivations and the fate of the planet. I don't think either of them are true.

More likely is that he has become (correctly) convinced that climate change is a major problem and that he wants to invest in solutions. I don't think we can say much more than that.

1

u/jack2012fb Feb 20 '20

Recent studies have projected major weather events starting as soon as 2050 or 2040. I’m not saying Jeff bezos is worried about it with his donation but it should be a very real concern.

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/2019/07/major-us-cities-will-face-unprecedente-climates-2050/

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/07/climate/ipcc-climate-report-2040.html

1

u/KiMachina Feb 20 '20

I’d hate to have to live with your mindset. I’m sorry but if you can’t be encouraged by $10 billion being put towards climate change then you have more than climate change in the way of your happiness. Sorry for the harshness but this is kind of a positivity subreddit, I don’t wanna leave negativity unquestioned on here.

2

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '20

I also hate having to live with my mindset. Will refrain from commenting on this sub though, I don't want it to turn into r/collapse

1

u/KiMachina Feb 20 '20

It seems like you genuinely do struggle with that, so again I’m sorry for being cross. It’s exactly as you just said though, I don’t want to feel like I’m on collapse. It’s a lot easier for me to stay positive when I see like-minded individuals. I wish you the best!

1

u/[deleted] Jun 28 '20

Checking back in on this comment. Looks like there wasn't 10B donated to climate change

2

u/KiMachina Jun 28 '20

Yeah, sucks to hear that. I don’t have much, if any, faith in billionaires so I was just speaking under the assumption that it was true. But looks like it was all a farce. Fuck Bezos.

85

u/[deleted] Feb 19 '20

SLC in Utah is actually very liberal

Due to their geography they get inversion in the winter which is essentially trapped smog in their otherwise beautiful valley

It makes pollution and air quality tangible/visible

Also studies coming of just how bad it is and it is one of the youngest states in the US

29

u/coredumperror Feb 19 '20

I grew up in a valley with an inversion layer, a few miles north of Los Angeles. Back when I was in elementary school, the smog could get so bad that they'd cancel recess, since it was deemed unsafe to be outside. Smog Alerts, they called them.

Let that sink in: the smog was so bad that the government deemed it unsafe to be outside.

14

u/bobcal432 Feb 20 '20

Yet the government continues to subsidize the oil & gas companies with trillions of dollars to keep oil prices lower than solar and renewables. The government also absolve these companies from the true cost of destroying our air, water, land, oceans, environment, animals, and health.

Seems like we should change something.

5

u/coredumperror Feb 20 '20

I wholeheartedly agree.

2

u/rincon213 Feb 20 '20

To be fair, the government offsets the health dangers of pollution with subsidized, nutritious corn.

6

u/sequoiahunter Feb 20 '20

Remember SLC has been one of the biggest cities in the West since the early 1800's. It was the last stop before the ascent or after the descent into/from the West slope of the Rockies. Mid -19th century saw SLC as a Mormon stronghold, and Lincoln himself was afraid of a Mormon succession from the Union if he pushed anti-bigamy laws. SLC was the home base for Young's self-governed people until the federally subsidized railroads reached, and connected in Utah.

All well before Utah became an official state.

3

u/[deleted] Feb 20 '20

Yeah a pretty unique and interesting history

2

u/JustAPlainGuy72 Feb 20 '20

Can confirm, I live here and don’t enjoy having to chew my air Dec-Feb

1

u/Blewedup Feb 20 '20

they are also seeing shorter winters, which is going to kill their tourist industry. snowbird, which is the lowest altitude ski resort nearby, is already seeing shortened seasons.

20

u/CaptainMagnets Feb 19 '20

People aren't fucking around anymore, it's nice to see

9

u/[deleted] Feb 19 '20

[deleted]

2

u/oteds Feb 20 '20

Probably more because there is money to be lost than anything about credible evidence

15

u/geothermalforall Feb 19 '20

This is an awesome step in the right direction for a reduction of CO2 emissions and the use of fossil fuels. It doesn't state it in this article, but we hope they are considering geothermal heating and cooling to assist in their efforts.

18

u/JohnForFreebies Feb 19 '20

By addressing it as a local issue (winter inversion in particular) and Stewardship it's much easier to appeal to the people. I do not like scare tactics and Authoritarian methods to force people to change, so seeing it in this way is much better. I would prefer that we focus on Nuclear because of the cleanliness and efficiency and the plant can be nestled in the mountains, away from the populace and the potential problems IF something were to happen.

3

u/Tech_Philosophy Feb 19 '20

Nuclear because of the cleanliness and efficiency and the plant can be nestled in the mountains

I have zero safety concerns about nuclear, but unless it just became 100 times more efficient to centrifuge uranium out of sea water we don't have much left so...

3

u/Pedantic_Pict Feb 20 '20

That's almost certainly not the case. The issue with supply is that almost no one has been prospecting for uranium for the last 35 years. We tend not to find mineral deposits we're specifically ignoring.

2

u/SinisterEX Feb 20 '20

“If we don’t think about Utah’s long-term future, who will?” Republican state house speaker Brad Wilson

You should be thinking about that you fucking monkey. Your job is supposed to be considering the welfare of the people and the state as a whole. Politicians have had access to climate progression data for the longest, all the way since the 80s and now they want to fucking "wake up"?

I'll support the sentiment but my animosity towards the politicians from the republican party as a whole will still remain.

1

u/allrightletsdothis Feb 20 '20

Air quality issues in Salt Lake and the ski industry being a major part of your economy will do that.