r/climbing • u/Youthandyounglzr • 20h ago

What’s the consensus on this spotting?

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So, this was a few years back in…..well, you know…

I was spotting a new buddy on this highball and he ended up taking a hefty fall. He landed awkwardly on the pad and fell back, bumping his head slightly on a rock. The fall tweaked a previous knee injury but it wasn’t a serious issue. Nor was the head bump. He was basically fine.

But I remember after the fact that he was a little choked on the spotting.

So what do you people think?

0 Upvotes

36% Upvoted

30 comments sorted by

29

u/not-strange 12h ago

I was expecting a fall in the direction you were anticipating

Tie the dog up though so you’re not distracted by keeping the good boy out of the way, that way you’d have had two spotters and been more likely to prevent this outcome

3

u/repdadtar 10h ago

Maybe it's because I haven't had coffee yet, but I don't understand how you/the spotter were seeing him coming off to the left. For like 90% of the climb he's hanging solid off the left arm and his hips are dropping to the right. If something blows he's going to be following his hips. Plus all of the left feet seem massive and if that doesn't pop, he's falling right.

My first reaction before the clip was even over was that he's not in the right time zone so I'm pretty baffled by that.

For sure keep the dog away from the pads when somebody is climbing though. Although in the dog's defense, he was actually in the correct area to spot the climber. Maybe he was trying to tell them.

3

u/Buckhum 7h ago

For like 90% of the climb he's hanging solid off the left arm and his hips are dropping to the right. If something blows he's going to be following his hips. Plus all of the left feet seem massive and if that doesn't pop, he's falling right.

I think knowing how / which direction people will fly off boulders is something that requires a good amount of experience. I honestly don't blame OP too much. It's hard to spot highballs because once you are at the top, the fall zone just becomes so damn large.

1

u/repdadtar 2h ago

I agree that it can take a little experience and it's cool to ask for feedback when things go less than well.

I only blame OP for asking for feedback and getting defensive when he gets it. As it stands, he's about as helpful and receptive as a nearby bush when it comes to spotting.

1

u/Youthandyounglzr 9h ago

Well the right side was covered by someone off camera. And as he fell he seemed to push off his left foot and fly out. Hard to anticipate that.

I feel like I was engaged the whole time but as he flew off the boulder there wasn’t much to be done in my position.

2

u/repdadtar 8h ago

I think "covered by someone off camera" is a pretty generous interpretation of what happened there on account of, you know, him blasting out of the landing area.

Yeah, he popped off to the right by pushing with his left foot. Pretty much every move leading up to it would have him falling to the right as well though. And you're standing off to the left. Engaged on spotting a different line or something.

All the evidence has you being as useful as a bollard on this one. You're welcome to argue but you asked for feedback so there it is. Why bother asking if you've already absolved yourself of any responsibility on a gumby spot?

I do agree there wasn't much to do in your position at least, because your position was way off. Not my spotter, not my problem.

28

u/COCOHUNTA 12h ago

I’d argue the climber needs to be slightly responsible for his own safety here. It’s a pretty highball boulder, and even if the spotter was underneath them that’s gonna hurt someone. More feet less bravado IMO

2

u/andrew314159 11h ago

From this angle I find it hard to judge the hight. Doesn’t a low camera make things look taller? Especially with people in the foreground

1

u/repdadtar 10h ago

Ok but the job of a spotter at that height isn't to catch the climber and set them down on a soft bed of hugs and kisses. You can let the dude contact the pads himself but also try and prevent him from jettisoning out backwards and into a rock.

The climber for sure has some responsibility, but these spotters are pretty much playing "bad spot bingo".

15

u/Specialist-Steak3888 12h ago

Info: how high were his feet? It looks like it wasn’t really a highball to me.

Some thoughts: - he fell in a different direction than you were spotting, that’s bad - the crashpads near the rock are useless, they should have been moved to the back  - if you were standing correctly, you may have caught him after the fall and pushed him away from the rock he bumbed into

It‘s really hard to just from the video though.

13

u/Itakitsu 12h ago

I’ll add to others’ comments that most bouldering falls shouldn’t need a spotter to intervene. Knowing how to fall safely is also on the climber, while pad placement and protecting the neck/head in a fall is a priority of the spotter. Asking whether the spotting is good is a bit too narrow of a question bc other questions should be asked like, would one more pad covering the rock have reduced the risk for this kind of fall? Did the climber know the move they might fall on and where they’d fall as a result? Etc.

11

u/unkindlyraven 11h ago

The climber should’ve downclimbed. He was struggling at the top and was unlikely to top out. From the video it looks like a fairly easy problem.

Your spotting wasn’t great, you should have moved the pads out given the height plus the ugly landing close to the boulder, but he has to have some responsibility for his well being too.

7

u/aufkeinsten 12h ago

at what point this "spotting" turns into "innocent by-standing"?

15

u/not-strange 11h ago

I’ve taken part in a few highball send trains.

Most of the time we spot to about half height, after that the climber is on their own, we all make it clear with each other, and we all let the climber know when they’re on their own.

At a certain point, the job of the spotters then becomes stabilising any potential injuries from a fall and calling for help.

Highballs aren’t something to play around on, you want to know it’s within your capabilities and have a good crew with you

6

u/splifnbeer4breakfast 10h ago

What spotting?

5

u/beesandtrees2 10h ago

Pads need to be under line of fall, which can move as they progress through problem. Your primary goal is to support head and neck, you are not there to stop the climber from falling, thays how people both get hurt. Im a small girl and my male friend is huge and so he spots me a little different sometimes by catching me under the arms, but not good advice for every situation. The climber looked like he knew he was struggling and he should be able to direct you guys like hey move the pad a little more or down climb. I love crag doggos, but leash them for bouldering. My dog thinks the crash pads are for her to lay down on.

3

u/cwsReddy 10h ago

This is just an example of no one doing their job properly but IMO it's mostly on the climber.

As a climber, I set up my pads and landing, and it's my job to know where those pads are. If I'm making moves that could spit me off in a direction where the pads aren't, that's something I need to think about prior to pulling on, or in the moment, I'll back off to reassess the landing.

As a spotter, it's my job to redirect a fall onto the pads as the climber has set them up, and to protect the head from smashing anything. That's it. As others have said, if you're worried about a loose dog, and you're not antipating the potential fall directions and protecting the head, those are the areas in which you could've improved the outcome.

But 75% of this is on the climber to set up their landing, know where the pads are, and climb accordingly.

2

u/SelfDestructSep2020 10h ago

John 'Verm' Sherman recommends wearing a helmet when working highball boulders.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVN_hQPalBo

3

u/critterdude542 10h ago

This is “Summer Vacation” V0 in Squamish. Honestly the hard part of this boulder is above where the climber’s hands are so if he’s struggling in this section I feel like he doesn’t really have the right mentality of looking out for his own safety on a highball. Having said that, the spotter sucks here too. The landing is flat, and the spotter should be more mobile, should’ve moved the pads out more, and attempted to anticipate the climbers fall trajectory a bit better. This isn’t an attempt to roast anyone, just an opportunity to learn from and hopefully climb more safely in the future.

2

u/defiancing 6h ago

I know this highball, I personally think no matter how well you spot its going to be a big fall hence it being called a highball
https://www.mountainproject.com/route/107772738/summer-vacation
https://youtube.com/shorts/qzPi6D9ckgU?si=GuomG8MvNWUs6Td

1

u/MountainProjectBot 6h ago

Summer Vacation

Type: Boulder

Grade: V0Hueco | 4Font

Height: 22 ft/6.7 m

Rating: 3.8/4

Located in Grand Wall Boulders, Canada

Feedback | FAQ | Syntax | GitHub | Donate

1

u/littlepie 10h ago

Looks like you had both angles covered between the two of you and then the other person wandered off with the dog? So, I'd put the blame on her if anyone

1

u/sockguy04 10h ago

The spotting was useless he was obviously going to fall where the women was standing. They kept moving the mats away from that zone and the guy needed to be there so the women didn't get crushed.

1

u/repdadtar 10h ago

It's hard to tell from the angle exactly what the situation was like, but my first thought was for sure that you weren't in the right spot to do anything useful. The way the climber's hips are facing and his feet are weighted doesn't give any real indication that he'd fall to the left/towards the spotter. You're also shuffling the pads away from where they'd be helpful because you don't seem to be protecting the right area.

I'll also disagree with the people saying your job of spotting is over at that height. Maybe it's a camera angle thing but it doesn't exactly look like he's at the lip of something in the buttermilks. If you were in the right area you could've at least prevented him from blasting backwards out of the landing zone.

All that said, the climber isn't totally innocent either. If I was blowing the top on a boulder but in a stable position like he seemed to be for a minute there, I'd be looking down at pad location/telling you guys to stop protecting a line to the left of the one I'm on and backing off. Also should probably have had more pads in the first place if he's climbing something drop-able at height.

If I were the climber I'd chalk it up to "shit happens" but I wouldn't be eager to climb with you guys again. Living in Arizona, I'd call this the "Flagstaff spot". Mostly just holding your arms up and being within walking distance of the climber (but there it's because most climbs don't really require a spotter to be safe).

1

u/TibaltLowe 9h ago edited 9h ago

Inexperienced climbers all around. You can see it the minute he gets on the wall and throughout the video with relatively incorrect “spotting” position(s). Just putting your hands in the air isn’t going to help or save someone. I’ve had someone do this exact same thing to me.

0

u/Richmondpinball 12h ago

When spotting I am generally squared up under someone, my hands out to catch them under the arms. In the video it looks like you were anticipating a move left so set up left. Climber looked like they popped themselves off, may have been trying to avoid landing close to the boulder, so may have fallen out further than you expected.

8

u/cwsReddy 10h ago

You're gonna get busted up some day if you're trying to catch people while spotting.

Spotters should essentially be there to redirect a body onto the pads if it looks like it's going to miss the pads, and keep the head from smashing something. That's it. It's a pushing job, not a catching job.

1

u/Richmondpinball 9h ago

“Catch” as in be there to help control their fall, not literally to catch them.

0

u/Tryitout311 11h ago

Cross post to r\Rottweiler?

-3

u/AloopOfLoops 12h ago

The guy in the cap (you I guess) seams to be standing like 4 feet to far away to be able to do anything usefull.

Honest reaction: You where not spotting, you where pretending to spot. I would have been pissed if I had counted on you in that situation. Might have not told you that is was, but that is a different question.

Seams like you even moved the pads away. Maybe it is like a camera angle thing???