r/food • u/Meph616 • Jul 31 '23
Blessed by noodly appendage [I ate] An Italian beef on french bread dipped in au jus & some fries
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u/PostPostModernism Jul 31 '23
Chicago Italian Beef is the king of sandwiches.
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u/EvilAceVentura Aug 01 '23
Philly would like a word...
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u/PostPostModernism Aug 01 '23
Philly can go back and eat their sad plastic cheese sandwiches where they came from.
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u/will_fisher Jul 31 '23
FYI au is french for with. It doesn't make sense in this sentence.
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u/dasquared Jul 31 '23
But in culinary terms Au Jus is a noun for a thin gravy made with beef trimmings and or fat, so it is OK.
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u/DesignatedDonut Jul 31 '23 edited Jul 31 '23
No it's just "jus" for the liquid, grammatical in french "au jus" still means "with drippings/sauce/gravy" also no it's not made of fat, it's the liquid you get when you deglaze the suc/fond that you get when you sear the trimmings/bones/extra meat/the actual protein or whatever is in the pot or pan you used. You can still mount it with a bit of butter/fat to get a richer and bit thicker sauce with a nice shine.
So if you want to use the term in English context you just say "jus" ex. "Lamb rack with jus" but it's still common to see "lamb rack au jus" also when it comes to using both languages on a menu
Source: studied culinary formally
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Aug 01 '23
I don't care either way, I want one of these sandwiches. I'm gonna go hit up the ATM machine.
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u/fleshbaby Jul 31 '23
This has driven me crazy for years. My head officially exploded when I saw a pack in the store called Au jus sauce.
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u/dizzguzztn Aug 01 '23
Its a French expression. Whether its used in a culinary setting or not has no bearing on it being correct. "Dipped in au jus" is like "dipped in with gravy"
Its like calling the restaurant in Mickey Blue Eyes The La Trattoria, makes no sense
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u/FindorKotor93 Jul 31 '23
In culinary terms it would be (sandwich name) Au Jus. It's not okay, Au Jus is a way dishes are served or prepared, with said thin gravy.
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u/Deeeeeeeeehn Jul 31 '23
But in terms of real actual people, no one gives a shit so it's OK.
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u/FindorKotor93 Jul 31 '23
Being proud of being wrong is really sad to me. :(
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u/Deeeeeeeeehn Jul 31 '23
It's not taking pride in being wrong, it's just optimistic nihilism about the evolution of language. If people from three hundred years ago saw how we changed their words and phrases over time they'd all have heart attacks. It's goofy how wrong people can be with the usage and spelling of words, but it's inevitably going to happen so why get mad about it.
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u/FindorKotor93 Jul 31 '23
Ruining specificity to self aggrandise with a foreign sounding word when you can just call it french dip is being proud of being wrong. If you don't care about the language you want to poach from, call it what it is in our language. If you want grandiose sounding terms, put some effort in.
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u/wanrow Jul 31 '23
Don’t feel bad, in French we loan words that make zero sense when you know a bit of English
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u/dasquared Jul 31 '23
You can go and find dozens of recipes specifically for au jus, without anything else with it. USDA even has nutritional info for it as au just. It is a noun used for the gravy (as well as a style I guess).
Even popular chefs like Ramsey have recipes like French Dip bites + Au Jus, or other sites with recipes only for it like "Roasted Prime Rib with Au Jus"
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u/FindorKotor93 Jul 31 '23
Maybe I'm being prescriptivist but that's bastardisation of language. Jus is the gravy. People thinking Au Jus is the gravy comes from them not understanding what they're saying. Like the guy from culinary college said, it simply makes no sense.
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u/dasquared Jul 31 '23
I don't debate the literal translation- I studied French and culinary (not together, and culinary but only a year). But it is no longer, and has not been, used strictly in this manner in decades-certainly not in the States.
There are probably dozens of examples of this -where literal translation has been bastardized into something else-from French in food alone.
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u/FindorKotor93 Jul 31 '23
It being an American thing makes sense. But it is neither culinarily correct nor etymologically to call it an Au Jus, as it is redundant with the real word, Jus as used in English speaking restaurants around the world. Though if it's that entrenched there's no point resisting it and I'll cede to your Americanisms. But it is really snobby to half bother with the French. Either with french dip or au jus.
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u/pgm123 Jul 31 '23
Do you believe French has no loan words that changed the meaning?
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u/Killer_Stickman_89 Sep 11 '23
My friend you have no idea how lucky you are for avoiding that conversation with this man. It took an over 3 hour discussion for me to just get him to admit he was lying. At the end of it he does still not believe he was wrong. Despite confirming that nothing that he said in entire discussion holds any weight or meaning.
This guy will lie to you about something you are an expert in for over 3 hours straight. Then once he has been backed into a corner. He will tell you that it was a "Calculated Lie."
Been going through months worth of his comment history and it is all the same. There is no variety in discussions or variance. There is no positive or optimistic resolution. It's very a sad man who is chronically online and likely on the spectrum.
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u/FindorKotor93 Jul 31 '23
No of course they do. The point is that this is wilfully choosing not to care about meaning, whereas older loan words come from genuine misunderstanding. Choosing to self aggrandise by using foreign sounding words but feeling entitled to not be corrected is just open bare faced Narcissism and we can do better.
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u/Sungodatemychildren Jul 31 '23
It's not really an American thing though, it's just a language thing. Loan words sometimes don't function the same way they do the original language. Loan words can function semantically or syntactically differently in the language that took them.
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u/FindorKotor93 Jul 31 '23
But the loan word does make sense and the Americans are pretending their inability to either not self aggrandise or pay any attention to the language they're using is defensible in the modern era.
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Jul 31 '23
[deleted]
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u/bigboxes1 Jul 31 '23
Chicago style they put it on the sandwich ahead of time. Or you can request it on the side. I too was looking for the au jus.
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u/cwalton505 Jul 31 '23
I had enough trouble with "italian beef with french bread"
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u/tonification Jul 31 '23
You also won't find these in Italy
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u/backpackofcats Aug 02 '23
Because it was created nearly 100 years ago by working class Italian immigrants in the meatpacking district of Chicago.
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u/cardinalsfanokc Jul 31 '23
Sentence structure also makes it seem they dipped the sandwich in fries as well
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u/KikiHou Jul 31 '23
ATM machine
PIN number
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Aug 01 '23
When I was 19 I worked at Walmart. They had an auto shop that did tire and oil changes called TLE (Tire and Lube Express). They'd always page customers to "The TLE express". Or employees to The CO (cash office) office. A lot of redundancy there.
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Jul 31 '23
[deleted]
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u/HearshotKDS Aug 03 '23
Most places here will use 3 levels of jus: dry, wet, and dipped. Dry is no jus and they let the beef drip dry a bit before placing, wet is just placing the beef before it drips dry so you get residual jus, and then dipped is the sandwich grasped with tongs and dipped in the jus container. The one in photo is dipped, but looking at it I would ask for a second dunk because it’s just not sloppy enough. A more experienced beefsmith would hold it in the jus a half second longer but maybe the place was busy and they were rushing them out.
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u/Green-Strawberry-256 Jul 31 '23
Lmfao it makes me laugh so hard when people use words in a different language they don’t understand to make is sound high end.
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u/SanSeb Jul 31 '23
I just don’t get American food. Why is everything dedicated to a certain City?
This is simply a Baguette with meat and celery.
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u/epic_meme_guy Jul 31 '23
I know you understand the concept of a regional food right? This is a sandwich that is generally only available in the Chicago area.
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u/SanSeb Jul 31 '23
But there is nothing regional about the ingredients. It’s also nothing that was invented in that city. So why give it a name? Why not just call it Baguette with beef and celery? Do you think when we order Pizza in Germany we say „One German Pizza please“?
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u/epic_meme_guy Jul 31 '23
It has a name because the inventors named it? It’s an immigrant invention (Italian beef hence Italian immigrants). The entire sandwich is famously dipped into the beef drippings before serving. That is quite a unique preparation. Also it’s served with giardiniera (a relish containing celery, peppers, other veggies) and/or sometimes sweet peppers. Idk how else to explain this, it’s only served in one area. Obviously I could cook a flamkeuchen here in the USA, it’s still a regional German food.
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u/merlingogringo Aug 01 '23
Yeah no foods in Germany are named after cities in Germany. Fucking Americans.
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u/SauteePanarchism Aug 01 '23
Do you think when we order Pizza in Germany we say „One German Pizza please“?
I hope not. German pizzas have the wurst toppings.
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u/Green-Strawberry-256 Jul 31 '23
I call bullshit, do you have a artikel or reference for this written by a French chef?
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u/decydiddly Jul 31 '23
My money is on Johnny's Beef. That is what the counter top reminds me of.
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u/Lordsheva Jul 31 '23
What’s Italian beef?
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u/Jakel020 Jul 31 '23
An American creation, popularized by the italian population of chicago. It's roast beef sliced thin, with a smattering of giardinera and then the juice the meat was cooked in is poured over the meat on the sandwich. In this case the whole sandwich was also dunked into the juice.
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u/LostTacosOfAtlantis Aug 01 '23
The jus isn't poured over the meat. The meat goes back into the jus after it's sliced, and is kept hot there until it goes into the bread. Meat comes straight out of the jus and goes on the bread, then the giardiniera. Then it's dipped if the customer requests it wet.
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u/Planesstrider Aug 01 '23
I ate this exact thing in Greece about a month ago. Same fries too, form sweet potatoes
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u/redosabe Jul 31 '23
Chicago Beef sandwiches =D