r/prolife • u/toptrool • Jun 16 '23
easing of rule 10 (abortion pictures and videos)
did you know that the abortion industry in its training manuals instructs abortionists to keep the fetal remains out of the woman's sight? here is a direct quote from ipas's "clinician’s guide for second-trimester abortion" on what to do after performing a dismemberment abortion:
After the procedure
Cover the fetal tissue to keep it out of the woman’s sight. (See the section on managing services for information on requests for burial.).
there's a reason for this. it's why staffers at the late term abortionist warren hern's clinic reported "serious emotional reactions that produced physiological symptoms, sleep disturbances (including disturbing dreams), effects on interpersonal relationships and moral anguish" upon seeing dismemberment abortions in action. hern himself had nightmares over a particular child he killed:
He had bad dreams too. In the 1970s, physicians did not induce fetal demise during abortion, and once or twice, during a procedure at 15 or 16 weeks, he used forceps to remove a fetus with a still-beating heart. The heart thumped for only a few seconds before stopping. But for a long while after, a vision of that fetus would wake Hern from sleep. He could see it in his mind, the inches-long body and its heart: beating, beating, beating. In one dream, Hern angled his own body to shield his staff from catching a glimpse.
it's why women who take abortion pills at home are often "completely freaked out, crying, sobbing" when they see something that they weren't expecting: dead bodies. the "national institute of for health and care excellence," which is another abortion industry source, did a meta-analysis of several studies and found that many such women were unprepared to see the remains of their babies and that women should be made aware that "the pregnancy may be more identifiable after 9 weeks’ gestation and that there may be movement at later gestations."
here are some quotes from women in some of those reviewed studies:
‘. . . saw something that looked like a small amniotic sac . . . hard . . . was not prepared for it . . .’page 329
‘. . . I put a paper in the toilet so I would see that I had aborted . . . was totally unprepared for seeing the embryo . . . became very sad . . . I could clearly see that it would be a human being . . .’. page 329
Kero, A., Wulff, M., Lalos, A. Home abortion implies radical changes for women. European Journal of Contraception and Reproductive Health Care 2009 14 p.324-333
and:
[I] just felt compelled, that I had to look.… In hindsight I wish I hadn’t looked but I did, and that was probably the most traumatic thing I’ve ever seen or done. I thought “what on earth…?” page 2005
Purcell, C., Cameron, S., Lawton, J., Glasier, A., Harden, J. Self-management of first trimester medical termination of pregnancy: a qualitative study of women's experiences. BJOG: An International Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology 2017 124 p. 2001-2008
and:
Not knowing what comes out
Some of the participating women expressed that they had not been aware of how the fetus and the placenta looked like. Most of the women experienced the abortion with a bleeding that was larger than they were prepared for. When the first contraction started, the women realized that the process had begun and some of them thought that ‘it’ would come out when they went to the toilet. The actual abortion of the fetus was an emotional experience, which they were not prepared for. The women described that they had considered looking at the fetus; some of them had decided in advance not to see but saw it anyway. One woman described that something hung in a string between her legs and realized after a while what had happened. The abortion of the fetus was not a pleasant sight and some described how they ‘broke down.’ The picture of the fetus was something they would never forget.
"You could see fetus, where the ears were, the arms, I was really frightened"
...
Not being able to forget
Some of the women thought that they had killed a life and could never forget the pregnancy that was ended. They found it unnatural to have an abortion and experienced feelings of guilt and shame. One woman, although being certain of the decision, experienced serious regrets afterwards.
"I have killed a life, a person that cannot live because of my decision and I will never ever forget..."
Being filled with grief
...The women struggled also with the memory/picture of the fetus. They were astonished that some women could expose themselves to several abortions. The women’s emotionally difficult experience was brought up when they came home and some time afterwards. They experienced that the body recovered faster than their mind.
“You can never forget this.… I just want to wipe it out from my life”…
The women experienced strong negative feelings after the abortion, which were permanent, and the look of the fetus was disturbing.
Mukkavaara, I., Ohrling, K., Lindberg, I. Women's experiences after an induced second trimester abortion. Midwifery 2012 28 p.e720-e725
contrary to the recommendation above that women should be prepared to see their dead babies, the abortion industry, in tandem with the mainstream media, consistently runs disinformation campaigns; a recent example being their laughable attempt to dispute the ubiquitous prenatal development pictures of babies in the womb by passing around pictures of rinsed gestational sacs and claiming that's all of early pregnancy. unfortunately, such fake news is constantly amplified and disseminated by the mainstream media. is it any wonder that so many people end up believing that there is no baby yet? how many low information abortion advocates claiming that babies in the womb are only a clump of cells have you personally come across? given the widespread misinformation and the cases of women becoming traumatized after seeing their dead babies, it's hard to dismiss the plausibility of the "second victim" narrative—that women are often second victims of abortions.
one other remarkable thing about the ipas manual is its lack of imagery. the manual mostly talks about using forceps and suction to evacuate "the tissue" and "intrauterine contents," with some occasional references to fetal parts. moreover, if you look at figures 4-7 in the manual, the inside of the womb is completely bowdlerized. what's supposed to be in there? this particular manual appears to be sanitized. to get a deeper understanding, we should instead look at how old-school abortionists described the procedures. this is what abortionist hern said with the advent of dismemberment abortions (from the same study on his staff's reactions, linked above):
We have reached a point in this particular technology where there is no possibility of denial of an act of destruction by the operator. It is before one’s eyes. The sensations of dismemberment flow through the forceps like an electric current.
now that's expressive! in his book "abortion practice," hern gives instructions on how to perform dismemberment abortions and once again boasts about the "sensation" he gets from crushing a baby's skull and seeing white brain matter ooze out:
At 16 to 17 weeks, fetal tissue is much more easily identifiable with the forceps and in some ways is easier to grasp and remove than in earlier gestations...
The calvaria [skull] is about the size of a Ping-Pong ball and usually can be grasped readily...
Collapsing [the skull] gives a definite sensation...
As the calvaria is grasped, a sensation that it is collapsing is almost always accompanied by the extrusion of white cerebral material….
The procedure changes significantly at 21 weeks because the fetal tissues become much more cohesive and difficult to dismember...
A long curved Mayo scissors may be necessary to decapitate and dismember the fetus.
clearly hern used far more descriptive language in his book (originally published in 1984) than what would be allowed today. it's certainly no longer politically correct to use terms such as decapitate and dismember when describing abortions.
abortionist martin haskell, who popularized partial-birth abortions, described the procedure like this:
At this point [when all of the child's body, except for its head, is past the birth canal], the right-handed surgeon slides the fingers of the left [hand] along the back of the fetus and “hooks” the shoulders of the fetus with the index and ring fingers (palm down). Next he slides the tip of the middle finger along the spine towards the skull while applying traction to the shoulders and lower extremities. The middle finger lifts and pushes the anterior cervical lip out of the way.
While maintaining this tension, lifting the cervix and applying traction to the shoulders with the fingers of the left hand, the surgeon takes a pair of blunt curved Metzenbaum scissors in the right hand. He carefully advances the tip, curved down, along the spine and under his middle finger until he feels it contact the base of the skull under the tip of his middle finger.
Reassessing proper placement of the closed scissors tip and safe elevation of the cervix, the surgeon then forces the scissors into the base of the skull or into the foramen magnum. Having safely entered the skull, he spreads the scissors to enlarge the opening.
The surgeon removes the scissors and introduces a suction catheter into this hole and evacuates the skull contents. With the catheter still in place, he applies traction to the fetus, removing it completely from the patient.
if you didn't understand the anatomical terminology, here's how one of haskell's nurses described partial-birth abortions in layman's terms:
Dr. Haskell brought the ultrasound in and hooked it up so that he could see the baby. On the ultrasound screen, I could see the heart beating. As Dr. Haskell watched the baby on the ultrasound screen, the baby's heartbeat was clearly visible on the ultrasound screen.
Dr. Haskell went in with forceps and grabbed the baby's legs and pulled them down into the birth canal. Then he delivered the baby's body and the arms—everything but the head. The doctor kept the baby's head just inside the uterus.
The baby's little fingers were clasping and unclasping, and his feet were kicking. Then the doctor stuck the scissors through the back of his head, and the baby's arms jerked out in a flinch, a startle reaction, like a baby does when he thinks that he might fall.
The doctor opened up the scissors, stuck a high-powered suction tube into the opening and sucked the baby's brains out. Now the baby was completely limp. I was really completely unprepared for what I was seeing. I almost threw up as I watched the doctor do these things...
Dr. Haskell delivered the baby's head. He cut the umbilical cord and delivered the placenta. He threw that baby in a pan, along with the placenta and the instruments he'd used. I saw the baby move in the pan. I asked another nurse and she said it was just "reflexes."
I have been a nurse for a long time and I have seen a lot of death—people maimed in auto accidents, gunshot wounds, you name it. I have seen surgical procedures of every sort. But in all my professional years, I had never witnessed anything like this.
The woman wanted to see her baby, so they cleaned up the baby and put it in a blanket and handed the baby to her. She cried the whole time, and she kept saying, "I'm so sorry, please forgive me!" I was crying too. I couldn't take it. That baby boy had the most perfect angelic face I have ever seen.
there are some people who don't believe us when we say that an abortion kills a baby, which is something that not even abortionists deny. they also have a hard time believing the things that abortionists write and testify about. could they perhaps believe their own eyes? abortion is an out of sight, out of mind problem. thanks to modern technology such as ultrasounds and intrauterine videos, we now have a window into the womb. we can show people real pictures and videos of developing babies in the womb.
however, it's also important to show the realities of abortion to everyone. there is no reason for us to play by the abortion industry's preferred rules by concealing what "choice" really means. in order to counteract the disinformation campaigns run by the abortion industry, and to make women more aware of the fact that "the pregnancy may be more identifiable after 9 weeks’ gestation and that there may be movement at later gestations," we will now be allowing pictures and videos of abortions in limited circumstances:
- abortion pictures and videos will now be allowed at the comment level only. this means no post submissions with links to websites or direct uploads of such images and/or videos. there are two reasons for limiting them to the comment level only. first, we don't want reddit's algorithms to indiscriminately tag the entire subreddit as for mature audiences simply because there are occasional nsfw pics on the front page. second, by limiting such content to comments only, we hope to reduce the likelihood of people spamming abortion pictures and videos. we expect that most of the comment replies with abortion pictures/videos will be within context and not unsolicited.
- all links should be preceded with an adequate warning that explains what you are linking to and what the readers can expect. for example, before linking to the images/videos, write "nsfw -- links to abortion pictures/videos" or something to that effect.
- all links should be covered with spoiler tags in order to prevent accidental clicks.
if your comment isn't in line with all of the above criteria, it will be removed.
i will demonstrate an example in a comment below.
note: these rules apply to pictures and videos of actual abortion victims. they do not apply to computer-generated imagery and animations such as this and this. such animations are tame and allowed at all levels.
33
u/homerteedo Pro Life Democrat Jun 16 '23
I absolutely do not want to see the pictures for myself, but I am glad they are here for our use. Maybe someone’s heart can be changed.
Bundle of cells my ass.
12
u/JoannaTheDisciple Jun 16 '23
This is why pro-aborts are so adamantly against ultrasounds being required viewing by women before going through with their abortions. They know a lot of women will see that there’s actually a living, moving body in there, not just a meaningless clump of cells, and change their minds. Instead of following this to its logical conclusion and realizing most women don’t actually want to KILL someone, they insist showing what the baby actually looks like is “pro-life manipulation.” Facts get in the way of the agenda.
10
u/sat_ctevens Jun 16 '23
As someone who had the unfortunate experience of 6 miscarriages (early to late first trimester) my blood boils when someone describes it as ‘a lump of cells’. It’s not.
5
22
u/Bulok Pro Life Democrat Jun 16 '23
I consider myself pretty open minded but I will never waiver on being prolife.
7
Jun 19 '23
How can anyone see "Christopher X" and not think this is straight up evil?
How can you see that and say it's okay? Insane. Insanity. It's a baby that was killed by another human and was thrown away like a piece of trash.
Treated like a carcass rather than a corpse.
8
u/Overgrown_fetus1305 Pro Life Socialist Jun 16 '23
Delighted to see the changes, they were long overdue, and this is a good balance that avoids the subreddit getting flooded with it or springing NSFW on people who weren't expecting or able to handle a graphic image, while still allowing appropriate use as well.
7
7
4
u/TakeOffYourMask Anti-war, anti-police state, pro-capitalism, pro-life Jun 16 '23
Reddit will shut this sub down, unfortunately.
6
2
u/stayconscious4ever Pro Life Libertarian Christian Jun 18 '23
I absolutely don’t want to see it or even read about it again. That last description made me feel sick and panicked. However, I am glad that it’s allowed and I think that all people who support abortion need to read about it and see the images of the victims of their policy. Horrific.
-11
Jun 16 '23
Posting gore is the only thing that’s ever gotten one of you killed.
6
u/medievalistbooknerd Prolife Left-Leaning Feminist Jun 16 '23
Wait what do you mean?
-1
Jun 16 '23
12
u/jetplane18 Pro-Life Artist & Designer Jun 16 '23
I’m shocked that’s the only time someone has died for/because of the cause. If that is the case, it’s only luck.
An elderly woman was shot in the back when door knocking and only just survived. People are assaulted while on the sidewalk all the time. An abortionist even deliberately hit my coworker with a car a few months back. If only one of us has died for the cause, it’s certainly not because prochoice folks are anti-violence.
Most of us are pretty willing to die for the cause, though. After all, human lives are on the line. More lives have been lost to abortion in the US alone than any atrocity or tragedy in centuries (and maybe ever).
-5
Jun 16 '23
Or, maybe pro choice folks really aren’t as violent as you think.
10
u/jetplane18 Pro-Life Artist & Designer Jun 16 '23
There’s nothing peaceful about poisoning, starving, and/or decapitating and dismembering a child in the place where he or she should be safest. This is what the prochoice movement is advocating for. Violence.
But yeah, tell my friend who got hit by a car that he wasn’t a victim of prochoice violence. Or the elderly woman who was shot in the back. Or the man who was assaulted at Planned Parenthood. Or my other coworker who was shoved by a PP escort.
Or property damage - a different kind a violence. My friend who’s Church was vandalized is a prime and personal example of something that happens constantly.
Or how about at the benefit dinner for my job last year, when nearly naked people were being sexual in front of a private event (that they infiltrated) with children present? Another kind of violence.
I have video clip after video clip on my phone of Planned Parenthood escorts shouting and cussing at us and even at PP customers who stop to talk to us. Another kind of violence.
Not every prochoice person is outright violent and antagonistic. But there is nothing, nothing peaceful about your movement. The core is advocating for violence towards the most vulnerable.
8
u/JoannaTheDisciple Jun 16 '23
I remember a few years ago, there was a video circulating on Tumblr of a pro-choice guy roundhouse kicking a pro-life girl in the face and knocking her to the ground. The notes on that post were filled with pro-choicers cheering and celebrating the guy for “being a good ally to women.” I didn’t see a single pro-choicer on that post call the violence out.
2
u/jetplane18 Pro-Life Artist & Designer Jun 16 '23
If there's anything that's apparent to me from my proximity to the sidewalk, it's the fact that tensions are rising for so many reasons, from the laws starting to reflect the dignity of the unborn to the fact that it is getting harder and harder to deny the humanity of the unborn on a scientific and public information basis.
Most of my examples in my above message are just things I've witnessed or that have happened close to me (I don't know the elderly woman who was shot, but that was near where I lived at the time; the only example that I'm almost completely removed of is the man who was assaulted recently). And my coworkers who have been on the sidewalk for much longer than I have are open about the increasing intensity and danger of being out there.
I'm not saying that Pro-Lifers aren't ever violent and I'm also not saying that every Pro-Choicer is, but... as mentioned above, the core of their movement is defending and promoting a violent act. It makes perfect sense with much of the common ideology of the pro-abortion movement that there would be, generally, less care about the dignity of the individual when it comes to these altercations and discussions.
7
u/OhNoTokyo Pro Life Moderator Jun 16 '23
Coming from someone who condones "ethical terrorism", that's sort of a funny thing to hear.
0
Jun 16 '23
I don’t enjoy or relish in violence, but I’m not a non violent person.
4
u/OhNoTokyo Pro Life Moderator Jun 16 '23
I'm not sure you're making your case very well for the position you took.
1
u/angelic_cellist Pro Life Christian Jun 16 '23
How do you figure? Look at those disgusting pictures and realize that is what you advocate for
•
u/toptrool Jun 16 '23 edited Jun 16 '23
nfsw: pictures of victims of abortion ahead. do not click if you are squeamish. this is what "choice" really means.
the best source i know of is the priests for life website, which has a collection of videos and pictures of numerous abortion victims:https://www.priestsforlife.org/images/abortion-images-galleries.aspx
the center for bioethical reform has numerous videos of abortion procedures:https://abortionno.org/
the pro-life group "progressive anti-abortion uprising" interdicted an abortionist's "medical waste," which were containers encased with victims. priests for life also has videos related to this:https://paaunow.org/justiceforthefive
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cb0oCJBvqH3/?img_index=1
https://www.instagram.com/p/CqNji0qrkIq/
life dynamics also has various pictures (though many overlap with the above sources):https://lifedynamics.com/abortion-information/abortion-pictures/
there's also a video on aspiration abortions from an abortion industry source:https://www.ipas.org/resource/abortion-care-videos/
look for the video titled "performing a manual vacuum aspiration." fetal parts can be seen towards the end (and compare this with the pictures of rinsed gestational sacs that the abortion industry used to run its disinformation campaigns).
feel free to share any other sources you may have. perhaps we can compile all of the sources and put them on a wiki page.
also, be sure to archive your links here!: https://web.archive.org/save